Welcome Guest Sign up! | Login  

 
FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Joystick settings & RS
 Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Targetware Forum Index » Mods » Richthofen's Skies
Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic Printable version Log in to check your private messages View next topic
Author Message
DantesOffline



Joined: Jul 04, 2003
Posts: 179
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2004 - 11:33 AM Reply with quote Back to top
I decided to go through the whole process. I deleted my joystick file, went into TW and it re-created itself.

I then decided to get rid of all the default adjustments. I took anything out that might even remotely cause a change.

I then re-calibrated the stick and centred it and clicked done.

You know what? All the aircraft fly beautifully now! They fly exactly how people were describing. Even the Camel did not require me to use a large amount of stick. Just like Zabatt said, a slight touch forward on the stick (and I mean touch) and I could keep it level comfortably without cramping up my hand or straining against the controls.

All that porpoising is gone too. I feel like I can get a good guns solution. I practiced on some hangesrs and I was hitting where I wanted to.

I don't know if it was a case of the stick file re-creating itself or getting rid of all the variables but it feels freakin' fantastic now.

To be sure, I tried it with my CH stick, my Sidewinder Precision Pro and even my unruly MS FF 2. They all felt great.

I am sorry I was harsh to some forum posters earlier, but I could not understand what I was doing wrong. What it seems I was doing wrong was messing around with the file looking for a solution when I should have just leveled it all out and left it alone.

Here are my settings in all their simplicity:

[Axis X]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Axis Y]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Axis RZ]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Axis U]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 1
reverse = 0

It's like night and day for me now and the aircraft act like I have read about and flying is fun again. It's a miracle.

Either that or I got really experten in the last 10 minutes. Wink

Anyways I'm happy again. I'm not touching these stick settings again just in case something happens.

S!


Last edited by Dantes on Aug 12, 2004 - 07:13 PM; edited 1 time in total
View user's profile Send private message
GH_LiesteOffline



Joined: Feb 23, 2004
Posts: 2993
Location: Bath, UK
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2004 - 11:38 AM Reply with quote Back to top
Call it the experten thing and be happy Wink

_________________
P4 2.4Ghz
Ti6600 256mb
SBLive 5.1
1Gb DDR 3200
40Gb IDE, 250Gb IDE
WinXP home SP2
Dx9.0c
SW FFB2 controller
View user's profile Send private message
chiggy_v



Joined: Jun 06, 2004
Posts: 612
Location: Virginia USA
Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2004 - 11:44 AM Reply with quote Back to top
Yes first rule of flight, take credit for the good things and blame the software and hardware for the bad! Works for me! Wink

_________________
System - Athlon 64 3000+ 939 socket CPU
Chaintech Nforce4 motherboard
Chaintech 6600 PCI-E Nvidia card 256mb
Windows XP professional
1 gig DDR 400 memory
MS Stick
100fps
http://www.pigstompers.net
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ZabattOffline



Joined: May 11, 2003
Posts: 2882
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2004 - 11:57 AM Reply with quote Back to top
I'm very happy it worked for you Dantes. Since my first day in this sim I've seen hundreds of cases like this and I myself had spent a month flying with settings which, according to the developers, were "impossible" (I'd put negative scaling into the config file, he he! Laughing We had no GUI at the time...). That is why me and others are always so thick headed when insisting that people should try to fix their stick settings first. Really happy it worked. Smile

_________________
--
Zabatt

Onryou Chuutai

PRF Newsletter: PRF-Newsletter-subscribe@yahoogroups.com


iMac G5 2Ghz/1GB RAM/128MB VRAM/OS X 10.4.2
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
SanderOffline



Joined: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 173
Location: Warszawa, Polska
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2004 - 01:26 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Cool Laughing

_________________
maj. pil. Sander
1. Pułk Lotniczy/1. Eskadra Myśliwska (1Esk)
Oficer Dowodzący
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
manoOffline



Joined: Aug 16, 2003
Posts: 362
Location: Northern California
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2004 - 05:54 PM Reply with quote Back to top
WTG Dantes Smile

I'll soon be the Mano of Old he he Very Happy
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
DraconOffline



Joined: Aug 05, 2003
Posts: 32

Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2004 - 05:23 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Hmm..........Even the Camel?? Oddly, everything flies just great for me but the Camel. I'm still 30 degrees forward and to the right 10-15 degress to the right. Flyable but Fightable's gonna be a bit!

My centering is at 39??? I think I'll just change to your setting in my config and see how that goes. You almost indicate that things are like "Stuck" and you needed to clear out the old first? Could you be more specific?
Thanks for the info,
Dracon

_________________
Dracon,
Intel CoreDuo Conroe 3.00 GHz
ABIT IP-35 Pro Motherboard
2 Gig Corsair 6400C4DHX RAM
EVGA 8800GT SC 512
HDD WD Raptor 150G 10,000 rpm
Monitor HP LP1965
CH Pro HOTAS and Pedals
Windows XP Pro - SP3
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
DantesOffline



Joined: Jul 04, 2003
Posts: 179
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 07, 2004 - 02:33 AM Reply with quote Back to top
Hey Dracon.

I think the main problem might have been actually having a small bit of deadband and damper. I think by having the deadband, it was somehow scrunching up the axis movement into a smaller area of the stick throw.

The damper I realized after playing a little more was causing more harm than good. By having it, I tended to use over compensation any move I made on the stick due to it offsetting the response time of the move. So, in a scissors engagement, I was overthrowing the stick when it was just a matter of the move playing out (if that makes sense).

I agree the Camel does still require a small amount of off centre to keep it level but nowhere as much as before. A slight move is much more relaxing for my hand and arm and did not cramp me using the MSFF2. Also, by making everything linear (and that would include any scaling in the stick software you use. You use CH right?) My main problem of the bouncy gun platform is much smoother and more controllable.

I'm starting to think that maybe the head bob movement in TW also threw me off being used to locked head positions. The bob coupled with the throw of the stick move making it look more pronounced. Now it doesn't feel like my pilot has to desperately go to the bathroom. Wink

The Camel is still not perfect centre on the stick, but the movements fall in line more with what I was expecting the airplane to do. Before it felt way too pronounced and uncontrollable. The EIII also displays this tendency to want to go up but now the pitch moves feel smooth and controllable.

Try deleting the stick file, putting all the axis to what I listed and then calibrate the stick. I think it may have helped to do it in that order.

Ultimately, I was hoping was to get a similar response on my stick that others were describing in posts. Now that I have that I'm content to watch the FM's evolve and improve (being works in progress).

The joystick interface and curve centering shift scaling would be good to consider but now I can enjoy the flying which is what I needed to find. The other stuff can come later. I guess in a way I just turned off the variables to have a clean interface with the TW FM's. Wink

Good luck and PM me if you have any other thoughts on the matter.

S!
View user's profile Send private message
manoOffline



Joined: Aug 16, 2003
Posts: 362
Location: Northern California
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 11, 2004 - 06:51 PM Reply with quote Back to top
> PUNT <

This is a good thread for those new to RS.

S!

_________________
Everything is funny as long as it is happening to somebody else.
- Will Rogers (1879 - 1935)
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
blkmgcOffline



Joined: Jun 15, 2003
Posts: 16

Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 12, 2004 - 07:07 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Quote:
I deleted my joystick file, went into TW and it re-created itself.


So what your saying is that you deleted in entirety the file; c=>program files=> Targetware=>data=> joysticks ? Or did you delete just the files for your controllers in the joystick file? I'd like to give this a go, but dont want to delete something I need by mistake.

blkmgc
AOD
View user's profile Send private message
DantesOffline



Joined: Jul 04, 2003
Posts: 179
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 12, 2004 - 07:16 PM Reply with quote Back to top
I deleted the text file in the Joysticks folder. Make a backup just in case you want to quickly revert back. It re-creates itself upon launching TW. I hope it helps.

S!
View user's profile Send private message
DaffOffline



Joined: Jan 07, 2004
Posts: 73
Location: London, UK
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 12, 2004 - 08:11 PM Reply with quote Back to top
I had to re-install TW and associated mods for my stick to behave..deleting the joystick files didnt do anything for me.
(FWIW)

Daff

_________________
303 Kosciuszko RAF
www.northholtwing.com/wing/
------------------------------------
Paranoia så det støjer, fuldstændigt forrykt!!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
manoOffline



Joined: Aug 16, 2003
Posts: 362
Location: Northern California
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Aug 21, 2004 - 01:10 AM Reply with quote Back to top
...

...

...



PUNT !




good post

_________________
Everything is funny as long as it is happening to somebody else.
- Will Rogers (1879 - 1935)
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
kevmusicOffline



Joined: Jun 24, 2004
Posts: 300
Location: Kent, UK
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Oct 13, 2004 - 06:06 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Am I missing the point in some of the above posts? I have deleted the default joystick notepad file and created another according to Dantes's formula. And yes, when I run TW the old file re-creates itself and the Camel porpoises like hell! - bloody frustrating with a target hanging about in front of the nose! Mad Pressing the tit as the nose swings past the target like a bloody pendulum is no way to fight a war!

And what does PUNT mean?

TIA

Kev
View user's profile Send private message
spoonOffline



Joined: Jul 03, 2004
Posts: 444
Location: Brno, Česká Republika
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Oct 13, 2004 - 06:16 PM Reply with quote Back to top
wordnet wrote:
The noun "punt" has 3 senses in WordNet.

1. Irish pound, Irish punt, punt, pound -- (formerly the basic unit of money in Ireland; equal to 100 pence)
2. punt -- (an open flat-bottomed boat used in shallow waters and propelled by a long pole)
3. punt, punting -- ((football) a kick in which the football is dropped from the hands and kicked before it touches the ground; "the punt traveled 50 yards"; "punting is an important part of the game")

The verb "punt" has 3 senses in WordNet.

1. punt -- (kick the ball)
2. punt, pole -- (propel with a pole; "pole barges on the river"; "We went punting in Cambridge")
3. bet on, back, gage, stake, game, punt -- (place a bet on; "Which horse are you backing?"; "I'm betting on the new horse")

_________________
My spec: Notebook, mouse and 2 joysticks.
View user's profile Send private message
JoGunnOffline



Joined: Jun 13, 2003
Posts: 6094
Location: Lakeville, MN
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Oct 13, 2004 - 07:22 PM Reply with quote Back to top
On the forum a punt simply pushes the topic back to the top. Keeps it in eyesview.

Does your Camel porpoise when you hit shift A? autopilot? If not note the speed it is traveling at. Are you maintaining that speed as you near your target?
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
kevmusicOffline



Joined: Jun 24, 2004
Posts: 300
Location: Kent, UK
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Oct 14, 2004 - 10:10 AM Reply with quote Back to top
Hi Jo. Yes, it does porpoise as I go into auto: 2 or 3 oscillations before it settles. Same when I hold the stick steady after a manoevre. This holds true in both pitch and yaw. In s & l flight I have to input a lot of forward pressure, right aileron and right rudder (twisty stick) - giving me a sore wrist after 20 minutes flying! Sad The result in combat is that I can't get a sustained shot at the target because each heading change brings a series of oscillations and by the time they settle the Dr's gone! I try to fly balanced as poss.
But, it so happens all was well until a week or so ago. Because I did all this - creating new joystick file - a few weeks ago and it worked great. Then my computer went belly-up and was re-formatted and I had to start everything from scratch. Now I can't seem to get rid of the default joystick file. I delete it and everytime I reload TW it just creates itself again; so although I've got dantes's settings in a new file, I guess TW is using the default MSFF2 file that it finds in the joystick folder.

_________________
Dell Vostro 410DT, MS Vista Home Premium
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9300 Processor
3072MB 800MHz Dual Channel memory
500GB hard drive with 16MB cache
512MB nVidia GeForce 8800GT graphics
MS Force Feedback 2 joystick
View user's profile Send private message
JoGunnOffline



Joined: Jun 13, 2003
Posts: 6094
Location: Lakeville, MN
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Oct 14, 2004 - 05:44 PM Reply with quote Back to top
But it does settle? In other words after flying in autopilot for some short time (10 - 30 seconds?) it flies fairly straight without oscillations? I recently had to deal with a very sensitive rudder on a new plane we are preparing to show you guys and discovered that my old MS precision pro needed some deadband dialed in. I hadn't noticed it before but with this plane I really needed to come up with a trick or two to keep it straight on the runway until the speed got high enough to give me smooth rudder control.

I went to the joystick setup screen and identified which access my rudder was on. ( I initially intended to increase the scaling a bit). I noticed that when I touched the rudder that the ball (or dot) indicator of the rudder position did not center but would stop at two or thrgee points at the bottom of the curve near the center position. Moving the twist rudder exerting any force on the sticks rudder springs resulted in the dot indicator stopping in various spots other than center. I increased deadband until this behavior stopped.

If you would please check your stick for this. If you have no deadband dialed in to any axis then watch that dot indicator and gently move the stick without putting force on the springs. Does the dot move? If yes increase deadband until the dot holds the center unless you are into the spring range of your stick.

I'm not one of the hardware experts by any means. All I can do is try to help ya identify and work through the problem. I don't have this porpoising going on with my system. I can aim and hit my target.


Another thing to remember is that here in WW1 you should shoot from as absolutely as close as you can get. 300, 400 or 500 yard shots are possible perhaps but you don't have enough ammo to be able to afford to use it up on long shots. When your prop is trimming the linen on his tail is a good time to open fire. Smile Keep me posted as to your progress and maybe some of the Stick Informed will drop in and give us a few other ideas if deadband doesn't help.

Also note your speed when this porpoising occurs. Make sure your not on the edge of a stall.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
RyeOffline



Joined: May 15, 2003
Posts: 2746
Location: Nova Scotia
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Oct 15, 2004 - 09:02 AM Reply with quote Back to top
Many of us have the same problem Kev, here is what I did yesterday and it settled it down quite a bit. I still get some bounce but I am afteral moving through a fluid called air and I want to still feel it. Don't want to get arcadish Smile All planes after this tweaking were easier to control, especially on landing and takeoffs. Nose still "jumps" up if I dopn't have some forward stick, but I think this is correct.

On the "Y" axis I took scaling from 2.00 down to 1.40, deadband at 0.05, saturation I took way down to 0.65 and dampening is 0.05

I consider this a good starting point for me and will likely tweak it a bit more. It was the saturation setting that seemed to have the biggest effect (for the good) with my stick.

Let me know how the experiment goes, oh, I did all this while on the fly, set to auto pilot, made changes and tried them, then auto again etc..

_________________
Rye, "Mongrel Dogs" Squad
View user's profile Send private message
PolovskiOffline



Joined: Jul 24, 2004
Posts: 15

Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Jan 31, 2005 - 07:03 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Dantes you are a genius Very Happy
I have spent weeks trying to get this to work, finally I copied and pasted your settings into my joystick.txt and voila I can now easily take off!

One thing I noticed which may be relevant here, your settings have reverse=0 in them mine didn't (and mine is auto created by the program).

My OLD settings (not working):
------------------------------
[Joystick 1]
spring_scaling = 0.5
buffet_scaling = 0.5

[Joystick 1 Axis X]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 3
slider = 0

[Joystick 1 Axis Y]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 3
slider = 0

[Joystick 1 Axis RZ]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 3
slider = 0

[Joystick 1 Axis U]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 1
slider = 1

My NEW settings (working):
--------------------------

[Joystick 1]
spring_scaling = 0.5
buffet_scaling = 0.5

[Joystick 1 Axis X]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Joystick 1 Axis Y]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Joystick 1 Axis RZ]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Joystick 1 Axis U]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
saturate = 1
damper = 0
scale = 1
slider = 1
reverse = 0


Notice the reverse=0 at the end of each line? I wonder if this is the problem. Maybe it needs the reverse=0 I had random "flipping" in the opposite direction with very subtle movements before, even with scale=1 etc.

The game has been updated a couple of times and I wonder if this is part of the problem with updating joystick.txt properly?

The difference is like night-and-day just like you say, hell the camel was even easy to take off after trying to fly it with a flying saucer attached previously Wink

Thanks
View user's profile Send private message
DagobahDaveOffline



Joined: Jan 08, 2005
Posts: 136
Location: Indio, California, USA
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Feb 28, 2005 - 08:04 PM Reply with quote Back to top
New stick: Saitek X52. I plugged in Dantes' stick settings and it's like buttuh. I had the chance to try it with the default settings... gah!! I'd forgotten how difficult the default settings are.

My X45 stick has been passed on to my room mate, Golden_Ticket, who will hopefully get as excited about RS as I am. Smile Interestingly, I was able to talk him through his first take-off, no problem. Then we realized he still had his stick settings at default. After switching to Dantes' settings, take-off was much more difficult.

In flight, however, the plane was much more responsive.

_________________
Windows XP Pro; Athlon AMD 3000 XP 2.15G; 1G RAM; Radeon 9800 Atlantis 128MB w/Catalyst drivers; nVidia nForce audio; Klipsch ProMedia 5.1 surround; Saitek X52/CH ProPedals (stickset 1) or CH Flight Sim Yoke/CH ProPedals (stickset 2)
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
Monty-BurnsOffline



Joined: Mar 16, 2005
Posts: 9
Location: Ellicott City, MD
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2005 - 11:31 AM Reply with quote Back to top
Dear Dantes,
Thank you so very much for posting this (although I won't get to try it until Friday, I am away on business). Tuesday night I installed TW and RS on my iMac G5 with my CH Products USB Fighter Stick, Pro Throt, and Pro Peds and was going CRAZY trying to get it all set up, calibrated and configured. I am hopeful that your results will work for me and having me flying Friday night and over the weekend.

_________________
Best regards,
Monty-Burns
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Monty-BurnsOffline



Joined: Mar 16, 2005
Posts: 9
Location: Ellicott City, MD
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Mar 18, 2005 - 08:35 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Greetings,
Friday night and I am over an hour into configuring my controllers. I am using an iMac G5 with all CH Products USB controllers. I have only three text files in the Joysticks folder named by the software (not me) thusly; ch_fighterstick_usb.txt, ch_pro_pedals_usb.txt and ch_pro_throttle_usb.txt I did not create these files. They were already in the folder. Do I need to rename them for them to work and if so what do I name them? Am I missing an important file or an important part of the configuration? The configuration in each is the same and is shown below.

[Hat 1]
source = hat

[Axis X]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
damper = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Axis Y]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
damper = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

[Axis Z]
center = 0
min = -10000
max = 10000
deadband = 0
damper = 0
saturate = 1
scale = 1
slider = 0
reverse = 0

Not knowing how the planes should correctly respond I don't have a baseline for personal comparison or "feel". On take off it is very hard to get the plane straight down the runway and I have only managed three successful takeoffs out of maybe 10 attempts. I apply right rudder at takeoff and the plane wants to really go let, then back right and so on. It is proving to be quite difficult. I would be happy to privately email someone with my cell phone number, or email me yours and it will be on my dime. I really want to get this worked out and get up in the skies.
Thank you for your kind consideration and assistance.

_________________
Best regards,
Monty-Burns
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
RyeOffline



Joined: May 15, 2003
Posts: 2746
Location: Nova Scotia
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Mar 18, 2005 - 08:48 PM Reply with quote Back to top
You aren't doing so bad! There is a large learning curve here but some planes are easier to take off then others. Yes, they do go left, then right, it takes a steady hand to keep them going more or less straight. This is more the plane then your stick maybe.

_________________
Rye, "Mongrel Dogs" Squad
View user's profile Send private message
JoGunnOffline



Joined: Jun 13, 2003
Posts: 6094
Location: Lakeville, MN
Status: Offline
Post   Posted: Mar 18, 2005 - 10:56 PM Reply with quote Back to top
Hi Monty -

I found that increasing the scaling for the rudder is what I had to do to aid the straight path down the runway. I haven't looked at my settings lately but the only thing I recall was dialing out a little bit of twitching with the deadband for one axis and bumping the rudder scaling up to 2.5 or so. It is certainly different for everybody.

Best advice I can offer is to be ready to counter any roll and take a low angle of attack on your initial climb. You'll climb fastest with good forward speed as opposed to pointing the prop up and grabbing. Fly the Be2C or albatros initially and work your way up into the hotrods. Good to see ya back in the air.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:     
Jump to:  


All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic Printable version Log in to check your private messages View next topic
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 Targetware Forum Index » Mods » Richthofen's Skies
Powered by PNphpBB2 1.2a © 2003 PNphpBB Group
Credits